When it comes to art, the focus is often placed on the finished product of a piece being displayed. It’s a special type of focus that marvels at the result of an entity created in the name of a set model. achieving a certain result, the fundamentals your favorite piece comprise of - whether it's a song, painting, or genre of art. What if we instead adjust the focus away from the models and to the process that went behind a piece?
This is where 'process art' shines.
What is?
Process art is a creative movement that’s been making waves since the early-mid 60’s, U.S. and Europe. And like the human experience, it is boundless - there are no rules, instructions, or end result when it comes to process art. A level of subjectivity navigated by confidence and fueled by self-expression, a protest against rules and logic. It’s the force rooted within' the Dada movement and performance art, expressed within' the drip paintings of Jackson Pollock, and one of the many philosophies behind the visual work of Alabama's very own - Cole Bryant. Art that focuses less on making a piece about a theme, an entity portraying a story. But more on the story being the process that went behind a piece and how the artist felt during the time.
Line quality, composition.
I try to focus on my intention. As far as, if it were to be public. Mostly, first and foremost. I focus on the process over visual outcome. Over anything, which is difficult sometimes. Because sometimes I feel like I question my, like, double.. what's the word.. second guess myself. And I second guess my product. You know, what I produce? Like, if there's enough, you know, meaning behind it. So maybe it has a little more weight to it. But then I kind of go into this sort of cycle where I'm thinking like, well, as long as I'm putting the process.. first, and focusing on you know- how I'm making it and being deliberate with how I'm making it. Being intentional with my thought process between point A and point B, particularly with line making, then that's what's going to matter. Then that's the meaning, as opposed to if I were trying to translate some sort of message or theme through more recognizable visual ideas.
Like, if it were an interior, with a person or something. Who could identify with that and I'm also drawing like shapes and stuff- so it's like, oh, how do people relate to this? Well, that's what I think about. Does that mean anything, then? Because it's so abstract, then I just, I kind of remind myself like, well, I'm focusing on how I’m making it in the moment, and the emotion that I'm trying to translate in a moment. And hopefully, the more I work on it, the more I can translate the emotion through that process, in those bare elements of just, you know; composition, form, space. Space is huge, you know? As a photographer, you know that.
Cole Bryant - The Conversation
Ervin Elzie - Where do you work downtown? (during the time of the interview**)
Cole - I'm working for this person named Katherine Tucker. She's a ceramicist. It's alright, we make like, really high end pottery. Too expensive. It's not like Sharon pottery. It's just, I don't know, it's definitely restaurants like businesses buying- Yeah, it's alright. Pays well.
Ervin Elzie - Yeah, I feel like it's a process within itself though.
Cole - It is. Yeah, for sure.
Ervin Elzie - Have you tried making, I guess just like some “dope” pottery like out of- not out of whatever but I guess just whatever comes to mind?
Cole - Like 3D stuff in general? Yeah, I thought about it. Never taking it seriously, or like never entertained thought more so than just like thinking about it. I'm from Huntsville. North Alabama, but started making digital work. Well, dabbled in it in Huntsville, during high school. Microsoft Paint and then got into Adobe Illustrator. Which is the common tool for graphic design, advertising, print, work. Anything logos, t-shirts. You know I got bored. I got bored of doing, using it for what I was getting paid to do, which was, what it was used for and what it was intended to be used for. For, for commercial work. And when I was working in Auburn, even before that, too, you know, in Huntsville, it's basically, you know, slowly realizing like, you know, I'm not using it for commercial work all the time. I have these gaps while I'm working, where I'm just in this mindset, like what am I, what am I supposed to do? Well, I'm guessing I'm just gonna make whatever I want. You know what happens when you take a tool specifically made for a commercial purpose? And you decide to make it or use it in a way-
Elzie - Recreationally pretty much?
Cole - Yeah, recreationally for fun, like whatever you want to make, you can just make that. So that was the birth, you know, five, six years ago of what I do now. And over the course of the years, you know, it's sort of blossomed into this pursuit of, you know, fucking nothing really, like anything. Anything that doesn't make sense doesn't even have to make sense. Just hopefully it doesn't make sense. So that way, it keeps me interested. If it starts to make sense, then you gotta keep working. You're satisfied. You're done. Bored. It's flat. The soda is flat, if that makes sense.
Ervin Elzie - The same way you described it kind of reminds me of my uncle.
Cole - Really? Was he an artist?
Ervin Elzie - I would say.. not intentionally, but in his own way. And the way I say that is, he's a mechanic. He had that mindset of like, okay, I know how gears, engines, and shit like that work. So, the reason why I say he's an artist in his own way. It's like, it kind of blew my mind one day when I showed up to his shop. And then you know, I found out he knows how to fabricate - obviously, but it's just like, it's kind of like what you said- tools that were made for commercial work. He makes like these crazy grills, barbecue grills, but in his own way. Outside of that. He fabricates sculptures out of scraps of metal. I feel like I'm very different outside of the previous generation, like, everybody that's within my generation, my family. We're kind of like on the same wavelength, but like, maybe generationally it kind of like, shocked me. I'm just like, you know that's kind of dope. That curiosity. I guess not curiosity, but just like, taking that just being like, I want to make my own stuff. You know, taking the initiative to put your own thought process into your work.
The Early Days
Cole - Well, I was drawing from a young age. Drawing from a young age was the result of a natural inclination of exploring. Just free expression that any toddler or a kid just wants to do. It's amazing. You know, the time when you're a child- when you make stuff, so free of inhibition. So, you know, I mean you very well made a lot of artwork when you were a kid and made marks on paper, put things together in a way that you just- were probably unaware or didn't really give a shit about how it looked. You just liked it. That it was fun. So yeah, so I guess, in that sense, yeah, I was drawing from that age, but I really liked it. I guess, enough so that I kept doing it. So I've been drawing for a while since I was probably a toddler, but not, you know, consistently like I was constantly working at it and studying it academically. It stuck with me like I always enjoyed doing that. Now, all I'd want to do at my friend's house was draw whenever we were bored and stuff. But yeah, it was definitely my favorite thing, because it's fun. So I still draw still draw a lot- I've always drawn, or I've been drawing for a long time. I'm not particularly skilled in a traditional sense, but I try to hone my skills in a way that I see fit. What I want to accomplish, which is what I want. Accurate mark making and I want line variety, and I want to be able to roll to be able to create, you know, interesting forms. Make something look good on paper, and make something not entirely look like something that's in a fashion of what people recognize and more so in a way of something that mimics something familiar.
Ervin Elzie - I feel like that's what makes your style pop. I feel you not having a traditional style doesn't matter, you're just doing you. And with that being said, you created an entity, which is the body of your work that is unique to your own. And that's why it's able to withstand itself, because of the entity within it. Something you created based on, like you said, how you perceive and how you want it to be perceived. It's your world, it’s your oyster. So, that's why it’s special to everybody.
Cole - Well, I think that stems from an exploration of the ego. I think the people with the best styles are the best at expressing their own ego and feeling the most important, you know?
Ervin Elzie - Not following a train of thought but more like what they feel is casual?
Cole - Yeah, cool, great, you know, quote unquote style, which is incredibly subjective. Yeah, completely subjective. Yeah, it's just almost an extension of saying that I am 110% confident in my ego in the extension of who I am, you know, consciously. You know, people that I admire, explore things in a very confident way. And a lot of times, people that I admire are expressing things in an abstract way, very confidently. Like not in a traditional way, saying yeah, art is an exploration of ego, typically visually. Well, in many different facets of art, but I don't know. I mean, especially in the sense where like, when you're talking about you being interviewed about it, you have to explore, you know, your ego. You know, why am I, why am I so good at this? Why? Why am I making this? Yeah, I'm not saying, I'm not saying like, maybe I am saying, Why am I so good? I don't know. Like, that's just the reality, the nature of the beast.
Ervin Elzie - It is the reality of it, because it's just like, you're good at it because it's naturally what you do want to do. It's just what you do, you know?
Cole - It’s almost like the people that are down in the textbooks, history books, the people that can like- I don't know, wrestle or whatever. Wrestle the bull, wrestle the bull that is their ego, and tame it. Control it and have the confidence to be like, this is fucking mine. I'm gonna cut the head off of this mythological creature that is like my art. And it becomes real and it is. Art, Ego, and Identity - when it comes to the process.
Ervin Elzie - When it all boils down to it. You're expressing yourself.
Cole - Yeah.
Ervin Elzie - And it takes being open and vulnerable.
Cole - I really, you know, I think about anything, I mean I want to get good technically like I want to be able to control my medium, my media, in general- my tools. I want to be able to control my tools in a way that I want to be able to express what I want in an effective way. You know- there's gonna be a lot of bullshit along that path of creating what I want, and when I want to. A lot of things like low points and high points. I want to be in control of my media. And I want to be also equally like, as technically as I want to be in control, technically with media. But I also equally want to be in control with this ego that is so closely tied with art. You know, because the people that can stare their ego in the eye, and whatever, in whatever capacity. And be like, I see you and I recognize that this is present here. What I'm doing, and what I'm creating, and putting out into the world. I'm also willing to accept that and I see that and I'm not afraid of it. And I agree with what I have to do to make it valid.
Ervin Elzie - It's like, okay. The ego is sitting right next to me. It is a Pandora's box. Everything that I need, but I can't over indulge it. So with that being said, it has everything I need in terms of breaking through those barriers that require me to be confident and put myself in those situations- that I'm uncomfortable in. Not for myself but a person that's wanting to break a barrier that's outside of their comfort zone. You have to dwell within that. To give yourself a boost. But at the same time, you can't over indulge in that because with like, you know, that saying, you know, with a lot of power you can get lost. But with that being said, knowing that potential, you can't be afraid of it, because it's something that is useful. Something that you have to hone into and sort of like- meditate and work on controlling. Like Yin and Yang.
Ego
Cole - Yeah, absolutely.
There's balance. It's one thing I struggle with a lot, and personally. Struggle with seeking out inspiration, externally through other artists in the world, in general, especially through- you know, the internet, you can meet all kinds of artists. See all kinds of artists work through social media and the internet and stuff. And I feel like I really gravitate towards people that aren't afraid to make fun of themselves and put their self, their personality, their ego in a in a very vulnerable way. Put it out there in a very vulnerable way. That is, unapologetic, and unafraid, and honestly, I gravitate more towards people that have sort of like almost a satirical sense of humor towards their work, people that aren't afraid to make fun of what they're doing, and don't take it very seriously. And it's really easy to take your work very seriously to the point that you take yourself very seriously. And I, I personally have experienced that where I feel like, oh, I'm hot shit, like, I did this. I made this. So I'm great. Like, I'm fucking Gucci. You know? But no, I'm still at phase one. I'm still learning, I have to pull myself back in those moments when I feel like I am confident and be like, no, I'm not. I still have a long way to go. I guess further with that point, it's like when you see artists that seem like they have reached that point where they display a sort of confidence in a this sentiment of a reach of their peak, like they have reached a point where they are very confident and where they are and this is their style. They have met their mature period of their work almost too soon. Or something, maybe I'm projecting a bit I don't know. Or speaking towards something that I'm not exactly speaking specifically.
Anyways. The point is, never get comfortable. Never be satisfied where you are. Always try to push yourself. Never get comfortable within a style. Explore a style to its fullest, but never exhausted to the point that you feel like that's the only place you need to be because it was what was working. And I feel like a lot of times, with very short winded careers, like within visual arts specifically, like people find a style that they sort of pick up from a past style that they see worked for a previous artist, and they sort of decide to continue that style in a way that like they see that that worked. And so they're like, Okay, well then I know this is gonna work because I know it's not gonna fail, but the people that pursue a style that is not what they know they like, maybe this will fail maybe this isn't cool. You know, that's the stuff that I like. I'm saying work where people paint something that they know has worked for other people. And this is something that I struggle with. Personally, I think it's a very common thing to pursue because it's a hard line to ride, you know, you go full shock value almost? Do you go full anti XYZ, or do you go in the middle of the line and see what's happening? You know, visually speaking, do you see what's happening in a visual way that seems to be somewhat acceptable but maybe slightly pushing the boundaries? Or do you completely resort back to traditional media and resort to traditional visual language? Traditional composition and traditional color palettes. You see what I'm saying?
Ervin Elzie - I feel like it's.. curiosity is what fueled the drive to never be satisfied.
Cole - Yeah, exactly. That ties in everything we just said.
Ervin Elzie - Yeah, yeah, all these questions like, do I do this? Do I do that. Like, you do it, and you're like okay. Nah, this ain't it. You do this. You just keep going, you know, you're just going through various phases as an artist.
Cole - I feel like I'm perpetually in between all of them. But my eyes are always looking ahead. My eyes are always looking towards something that's going to push buttons. That's just personally where I see it. I strive to make work through digital media, because it is exciting and it is new. And it is something that people don't quite recognize as being an acceptable medium of visual arts in the same sense that when you went to the loo, and you saw the Mona Lisa, when you went to Chicago and saw Picasso. Or like, how many times when you go to all these prestigious museums and institutions of art and you see these very profound, eloquent visual representations of where art has been, and where it still stands. It's difficult to imagine new media in that same sense, when, ironically enough, those same pieces were in the same place in the sort of placeholder as new media is now you know what I mean?
Cole - Because art is all about making waves, art is about making something new happen. Everybody wants to have the new unique idea, the new unique standpoint.
Ervin Elzie - It wouldn't make any sense to like, continue. Like, you know, the traditional. Well, that's Yeah, actually, that's the thing.
Cole - Well, it's like, it influences the new stuff. It's still important, I think.
Ervin - Yeah, it's important. I guess I just kind of like I had an aha moment about the word traditional. Because it's just like, I guess, part of that. It's just the way we classify that as traditional. That's traditional. That means, to a certain extent, it's permanent. For some reason, we decided on that special specific time here that was going to be like, what is considered traditional?
Cole - Oh, wow. Yeah. For example, like you said, I agree with you. Art is about bringing new waves because it's like what's the point of just doing the same shit over and over? I won't dwell on that but, in general, when creating a new wave. It's hard. I feel like it makes it difficult because this is a new wave that’s not traditional, then it's just like, Okay, well, when are we going to classify something else that's, like, traditional when. Can we dispel that word? So nothing has to be rooted in something. It could just be a free for all, free thought. I guess there's no set standard of what something should be. Although, like you said it is important. Almost like it's free of taste. Free of subjectivity. That's almost anti art.
Ervin Elzie - I guess it kind of makes sense. Yeah, it's all right. I mean, like, I wasn't intentionally meaning that way by me I guess you could, I guess well, I guess yeah, it could be some that was just- I guess like the way that we use it, or I guess like the way that the general use of it, it seems like it's synonymous to permanent or like a set guideline on how to do something like we decide on this period versus like the period before where they were doing like, aztec drawings or The hieroglyphics. Like, what if that was traditional?
Cole - Know what if it was new?
So what constitutes something being traditional then something in the history in the past so it's so in essence anything that's being made temporarily is new. And it's always progress from you know, or it's like being added on or like taking from pass work.
Would traditional become more of a personal thing then like you said what the taste is just like okay so if someone tastes is this that's their from traditional, if someone's tastes was in like crazy designs like hieroglyphics and that's their traditional form of art, because that's like, where their style stems from, but it's within their own reality. Yeah, world how they perceive it.
It's just all subjective.
Ervin Elzie - Yeah, exactly. what it boils down to is it's all subjective.
Cole - Yeah. You know, Marcel Duchamp, the godfather of Modern Art man says that like all Artists should, well he doesn't say this verbatim, but like, talks about how like artists should live, make art and then die and then see how their, their artwork pans out 100 years later, they should never show their work, they should just die, have their work hidden and then have it you know, unearthed, whatever. And then shown later and see how it pans out. Because it's art, art is very much so long game. There's a long game to it. Which is something I remind myself very frequently in that-
Ervin Elzie - The instant gratification.
Cole - Yeah, it's, it's, it's such a polar opposite to traditionally how it's been when work is made and then 50 hundred years later, it's appreciated in a sense. This is why I hear so much about digital media. Because it's so unexplored, there is not a Picasso, Adobe Illustrator, there's not a Jackson Pollock. You know, a Kandinsky, there's not a best qiat there's not a Marcel Duchamp of Adobe Illustrator and Adobe Illustrator is the same thing to me as saying a pencil or oil paint, or marble or copper. Adobe Illustrator is in that family, but it is not yet in that family.
Ervin Elzie - In terms of perception.
Cole - Right, it is thrown into the sense of is a tool of digital media of contemporary art. And there's a lot of other media that falls into that. So within, you know, the VR realm, or within, you know, certain physical qualities, I don't know I can't really indulge in that any further, just backtracking a little bit, sorry. But yeah. So I draw a lot, I draw a lot. It influences my digital work, you know, because it helps me further understand traditional stuff that I've learned in school, like form, tone, color, space, line, elements of art that are very key to understanding visual language. But I take that and I try to sort of switch it up and realign it in some way that I find interesting through digital media and a lot of the time you know, kind of sucks but At least I keep pursuing it. And that's the point is that like, I'm going to keep pursuing it. Like I'm in this game for a long time. And I know that like, right now, what I'm making is not the best I could make. But hopefully 2025 years, 30 years in the making, I'll be making something that will hold some more weight.
Ervin Elzie - Better than what you're making now because you'll be a better artist.
Cole - Right? And it's because of the fact that I know that I'm making something that is a part of a very, very long process. It's almost like karate or kung fu. Kung fu masters study like Kung Fu for like- 20,30,40,50 years men need to study Kung Fu for their entire life. That's hard. That's how I view art, same thing man. It's, it's, a living lifestyle. It's something you embody today. in your day to day life, and it's something I still struggle with, but it's only because like shit, dude. I've been doing this five years, six years, maybe if I'm generous. I mean, if I'm really going to be like, oh, I've been doing this since I was three years old, like seriously been doing this entire series, I've been seriously professionally presenting or sewing it. Yeah. Professionally pursuing it, in a sense that I'm like, constantly studying it and working at it every day. Five, five years. That's like a spec. Unless you get insanely lucky. Which it has happened from time to time, but I'm not like that. I'm not insanely lucky. I know that I had to work at it. So I'm constantly doubting my work. I constantly hate it. I constantly try to improve it. I'm constantly working, I'm constantly trying to create and also I've periods of lols where I'm not making anything and I don't do everything to the point that I cannot create. And all the forms and the lines and the colors, everything is second guessed, and everything seems to fall flat, and everything seems like something else. And everything seems like something that came before and is not a part of my process. But at the same time. That's still part of the cycle.
The way I do the artist's process is a circle. So essentially, bear with me. I gotcha, gotcha. So when you first start making art, your artist's creative circle is small. Let's say it's this big. Okay. It's very small. You have an upswing, which is the upper half of the circle, and you have a downswing, which is the lower half the circle. Your upswing is your creative period, where you are beginning to create a lot and you have an upper period where you're making your best work for you. feel most connected to your best work. And then you have the downward swing to the top of the circle, you're still making great work. But you're starting to slowly sort of burn out. And then the downward half the circle in the beginning, you've reached the law where you're like, I cannot make anything and it slowly turns into this like, wow, like I really like everything you make a shift in your complete self doubt. So the bottom end of the spectrum, where here you are making the best work. Here, you are not making anything. It's the complete opposite. You don't make anything you doubt yourself. You question everything about why you're doing it in the first place. What's the point? And then slowly, you start to like, keep trying, you keep pushing yourself.
So okay, so once you get to here again, you have a new circle, the circle has reground into a slightly bigger circle. So now you're back in the upward swing, you keep making more and more work. Same thing repeats, you make more work. This greatest circle is making more work and because the circle is bigger, making more work, and then that upper swing, the upper Crescent is bigger, the results are better. Since the beginning the circles are small. So the upward swing is quick and the downward swing is quick, bigger and bigger. So what you conversely think when you first decide to make work, it's like, Okay, well, if an artist for a long time I can make better work more work at it, when really, in reality, it's like, the more you work on it, the bigger that circle gets, and the bigger those upswings get, and also the lower the low swings get and the more difficult it becomes to be an artist. Does that make sense? So like let's say you're like five years, Brian into the game. That circle is very large. You know, the circle changes from like week to week, month to month? The circle is huge by the time you're 5,6,7,8,9,10 years in the game, whereas in the low points become so much more devastating. Because you're like, why am I doing this, you're questioning everything, everything is just being criticized. Internally, introspection becomes much more devastating. But at the same time, conversely, those upward swings, you're starting to make work in the same time periods, the same time frames, you're making some of the best work you've ever made. Way better than the work that you look at when that circle was much smaller. Because you were making a lot of work in the beginning because the circle is very small. Because you can come out of the slumps much quicker, because you're really easy to get yourself back up because you have nothing to compare it to. But the further you work, the more you have to compare it to in the past and the more you study it, the more you realize you have so much clarity. That's why the circle gets bigger and bigger. Does this make sense?
Ervin Elzie - Yeah, in a sense, it's like the circle is the ego. The ego circle. Yeah. And if we were to put it in like terms a person that builds things just like when you're going up that spiral. Well, excuse me, let's start from the high points. The high points is the ego. Dwell in it. And then you know you burn out yourself. Then that's when you deconstruct the ego because that's when you start to doubt yourself. Deconstruction and then once you hit that- deconstruction is finished. That's when like the lulling begins. The lull phase, like okay, I'm done with it. I want to build myself back up, you build yourself back up. So use that as the foundation to begin to spiral. Exactly. You start. As you get better, obviously, your ego gets bigger.
Cole - Yeah. That's a really good way to put it.
Ervin Elzie - Yeah. Not mean like, everything is full circle. Like it all makes sense. That's true.
Cole - Yeah. But yeah, that's how I've always viewed him in everything's the process of an artist. Is the circle, and it just gets bigger and bigger and heavier and taller. The further down the road you go. That's why the more you work at it, the bigger the reward.And the worse the fall. You know what I mean? And that's why, and that's why a lot of people quit.
Ervin Elzie - I was gonna say, Yeah, exactly.
Cole - I meet so many people that are like, what's the point of this man? Nobody gives a shit about what I make. It's like, Man, that's not the point. No, you're not supposed to be making this somebody else. The point of view making this shit is to express something in yourself that you can't express in any other way. And that's not because you want to explain that to somebody. Well, it is, you know, in a superficial way, it is nice to be able to explain it. But regardless, I'm saying, That's not the point. You're not trying to do this to be able to appease somebody and impress somebody. You know what I'm saying? That's pretension. Pretension is trying to impress someone. You're not doing it for that. You're doing it to build something in yourself and express something within yourself. That is-
Ervin Elzie - The inner hunger.
Cole - Yeah, of course you can't. That's the whole reason you began the journey in the first place.
Ervin Elzie - You're curious.
Cole - And that's the hardest part of the game, man. Staying interested in keeping that same will, in a sense, the way that I'm explaining this right now,is the same way. The same way. It's like telling myself that, you know, I'm explaining myself right now. Stay with it, dude. You know, keep at it. I struggle with it all the time. And I've been in lull this past, you know, seven, eight months. And I'm finally getting to a point where I'm starting over, building up the beginning of the upswing, right at the beginning. Finally, fucking finally got dammit.
Ervin Elzie - Yeah. I feel like the biggest thing about the lulling process is using that as a time to meditate and just- remember you mentioned this earlier like- yeah pretty much meditate and figure out why you're doing this- the thing, and then, you just- you're pushing yourself starts to be like okay, well I'll figure the answers out. You get that sprint again but yeah, at another stage where, just like, okay, but I did like this because I believe but now that I've had these experiences, my thought process kind of changed. So let me think about it again. You know, why am I doing this? And then that's when the new phase begins. And it's definitely hard but you know it's necessary. It's necessary. Yeah, exactly. It's like, it's definitely necessary.
Cole - You have to undergo it. That's the thing with life man. It's the, I mean, I don't mean to be preachy man, but like, like the exploration of the soul is the same as being an artist and the same as just living. You know, being an artist is just somebody that's willing to, you know, I think- somebody that's an artist is somebody that feels inclined to express their journey through this of their soul, like, outwardly through some capacity.
Ervin Elzie - And you think about it. The whole embodiment of somebody's work is a timeline of that process. You have, I know I'm pretty sure you have a favorite artist where, you know, this period of time. They had a self discovery moment. Then this period of time, right.
Cole - Exactly. Yeah, exactly. And again, that's a testament to the long game. Like being an artist is like being a kung fu master. You don't become a kung fu master after like 2, 3, 5 years. It's like after like 30-40 years. So it's something that you constantly work at- day to day.
Ervin Elzie - Answering all the questions. Every single fucking question. Not just a few, all of them.
Cole - It's an understanding of some sort of capacity of the visual language that relates to how you feel and how you wish to translate that. And eventually it becomes about money and you know, you-
Ervin Elzie - You got to sustain yourself.
